Harlem Nocturne Septet

[rrayner]

Hi Sherry & David,

Thanks as always for the compliments. I have had a lot of fun over the early years and now again with this song.

Originally Posted by dj

Very interesting to see your use of the shorthand slash chords and repeat symbols we've talked about elsewhere. We don't, however, have a piano track here, just the slash chord symbols, so is there some "body" missing that the piano would have added?David

There is something "missing" alright, David. I did not graduate from Berklee, but left after 2-1/2 years to join the USAF Band. Perhaps in that final 1-1/2 years I missed, there would have been some instruction on how to write piano parts, but all I was given during my time there was, "Give the piano player a road map with the chord symbols and let him wing it!" Berklee probably handles that better now. Throughout the Forum, you will find pieces where I have written rudimentary piano parts, but not many. Where you do find some, they are written more like another horn part. If I could only find time to take some piano lessons, it might get better, but I am starting to feel the pressure of time, and I want so badly to write.

Another reason for the absence of an actual written piano part is that I believe that the horn riffs I used in this arrangement were essentially what he used to play behind me in my quartet.

Ralph

[dj]

[QUOTE=rrayner;65307]"Give the piano player a road map with the chord symbols and let him wing it!"/QUOTE]



That's like "How many bass players does it take to screw in a light bulb?" Answer: "None. The piano player will do it with his left hand."

Sorry, Sherry.

One of my sisters did a two-year program in jazz piano performance at Berklee. Me? I had six months of piano lessons from a guy who blew cigar smoke at me.

David

[Sherry C]

Hi David,

Originally Posted by dj

That's like "How many bass players does it take to screw in a light bulb?" Answer: "None. The piano player will do it with his left hand."

Sorry, Sherry.

That's ok, I tell that joke too.

And then duct tape everything left of middle C on the keyboard if the keyboard player touches it

ttfn,
Sherry

[aulos43]

Hi Ralph.

Nice.

Could you tell me what the intent of the slur markings over staccato notes is? Is that a breath marking?

I got the "Music Notation (Berklee Guide)" in February, but haven't had a chance to get too far into it. I took an orchestration class back in the 70's and have some background in reading string, keyboard and recorder music -- they each treat slurs their own way. And it varies from era to era and place to place, it seems.

Would appreciate the views of a working musician with a jazz perspective.

Thanks

Walt

----

[rrayner]

Hi Walt,

Yes, the slurs in this instance are simply for phrasing. The arranger does not want to the soloist to sneak a breath within that phrase. It would be very disruptive to the flow of the piece. Unwritten in the score is the implication that the soloist had better take a good breath before entering the next phrase. On a cold read, the soloist might not catch the intent, but thereafter, it will be remembered. Those are fairly long phrases and as they proceed into the lower depths of the tenor sax, a lot more air is required, particularly by the time you get to the sustained low B. I make certain to take a big gulp before the final eighth notes in measures 23 and 31 when entering these phrases.

There are definitely areas in scoring for jazz/big band where notation is a little bit different. Sherry commented one time about my usage of the tenuto symbol (dash over the note head), which in swing notation tells the player not to swing eighth notes, but to play each eighth note evenly, because the unmarked eighth notes are supposed to swing.

If I may enter a plug here for one of my former Berklee instructors, Everett Longstreth has a couple of very good arranging books for jazz and dance band on his website at http://www.everettlongstreth.com/. He was/is a very good instructor.

Ralph

[herbert]

Hi Ralph,

What can I say, “Nice”.

I note that you use for the bass a relatively low velocity of 48 and a volume of 100. This is what I usually do with an acoustic bass. It gives the bass a mellow sustained sound. How did you get the vibrato on some of the notes of the tenor sax? You clearly put priority on good notation.

There is a certain monotony, typical for computer generated music. It relates to the precision and with it, the predictability of where each note falls, whereas real jazz musicians play intuitively around with the timing, perhaps just minutely to create that extra expressive tension, generating a feeling of liberation, recognised as swinging. I have no formula, nor can I give any advice.

I am very keen about modern jazz. This is not at all reflected in my arrangements. All I do is to please a middle aged public.

Best wishes,

Herbert

[rrayner]

Hi Herbert,

Thank you for the compliment.

Originally Posted by herbert

I note that you use for the bass a relatively low velocity of 48 and a volume of 100. This is what I usually do with an acoustic bass. It gives the bass a mellow sustained sound.

This is an area that I am pretty shaky in, Herbert. I note that I do have the velocity set to 47, except oddly for the first note. Has to be a mistake. And of course, the bowed Fine is louder. I have not discovered the mysteries of working with loudness, except on a very basic level, and at that, mostly in diminuendi and crescendi. Basically, I set the velocity at what to my ear is a proper balance. I need to get more into the shading between velocity and volume. So far, to me, velocity is much easier to work with.

Originally Posted by herbert

How did you get the vibrato on some of the notes of the tenor sax? You clearly put priority on good notation.

I wish I could claim something special on the sax sound, but depending on which medium you are referring to, the mp3 file was created by going from Composer > export to midi > my Clavinova (which has some very nice sounds) > export to wav file > convert to mp3. The "not" file of course sounds as good as your sound card. However, I do have the Bank Selection customized for the Clavinova with Ctrl 0 = 0 and Ctrl 32 = 126, which may work some magic on your sound card. On the other point, I am now writing for a long-distance friend's dectet, so I want to make certain that the parts look good. I won't be there to hear what the players have to say, so I try to limit the complaints.

Originally Posted by herbert

There is a certain monotony, typical for computer generated music. It relates to the precision and with it, the predictability of where each note falls, whereas real jazz musicians play intuitively around with the timing, perhaps just minutely to create that extra expressive tension, generating a feeling of liberation, recognised as swinging. I have no formula, nor can I give any advice.

I understand. I am caught in a trap of professing to write with Composer with a better more natural swing feel. I could do a much better job of achieving this goal if I were to vary individual attacks and durations, but I am not trying to hit perfection -- just trying to get a little closer. When I play along with these charts on my Clavinova, at least it does not feel quite as stilted as without the attack and duration modifications I make. I am well aware that individuals do not play like machines and would never be as precise as a PC, but I am laying out the framework for some fun play-along and I have rationalized that I would rather have more charts to play along with than to do massive tweaking on the parts of fewer charts. My favorite instrumentalist for "bending time" is the alto man, "Cannonball" Adderly (deceased). I would love to see the variations in attack and duration on some of his solos.

Originally Posted by herbert

I am very keen about modern jazz. This is not at all reflected in my arrangements. All I do is to please a middle aged public.

All we can do is do the best we can and bring pleasure to ourselves, and hopefully to others around us. Keep the faith!

Ralph